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Telltales
So I was watching Angry Joe's impressions of the first chapter of Telltale's Batman story/game/quicktimeevent. I pretty much agree with his assessment, although personally I'm not interested in it anyway. Essentially Gameplay low scores, Story high scores. That's kind of what you expect out of Telltale anyway, and by now it's the story that their fans are buying the games for in the first place. So that's all cool.
He does bring up one point near the end however, regarding the season pass thing they do. Full cash up front, while releasing the game chapter by chapter. What it comes back to is this, why do people still give Telltale a pass on releasing the games piece-meal like this after they've been in the industry this long and in theory should be doing fairly well for themselves by now.
As a company starting up, I could certainly understand the episodic nature of their releases. You gotta get material out there ASAP to start bringing in money ASAP. You're new, you're likely a bit strapped for cash flow. But instead of developing into a more proper release schedule - releasing the full story on day one, they simply opted into getting you to PAY for all the episodes on day one instead. To the point where they nag you at the end of the chapter to buy the season pass. (As seen in Joe's video.)
At this stage of the game they SHOULD be capable of releasing the full story on day 1. They've gotten to the point where they're now losing, or drastically delaying money from fans who are no longer putting up with the episode release and wait (Quite intelligently imo) for the full story to be available.
Their season passes could be, as Joe points out, essentially additional chapters after the story - kind of like what they ended up doing with Minecraft Story Mode - although that opens up a new can of worms as well. For instance, if the main story isn't satisfying, people will start looking at the season pass as ripped out content. (Like most DLC appears to be these days, especially for game franchises that have been around since before DLC became a Thing. (Disgaea, I'm lookin' at you.) (Hell, I'm lookin' at you too Ar Tonelico))
At any rate, I don't a reason for them to refuse to release the full game at launch now. They're already charging full price with the season pass at launch of the first chapter. Why not just stop pretending the season pass isn't a preorder. Let them preorder it at that same price tag, then make everyone wait an extra month or two. Don't worry, they'll keep waiting for it. And they won't have that excuse of "Oh I'll wait until the full thing is out." to buy it at launch - although the excuse of waiting for it to be on sale will still be valid. But that's what those people are already doing anyway.
I haven't played any Telltale games. Not entirely sure why, as I rather like story driven games, even if they're hitting on 100 tropes/second. Although episodic game release has been on my shitlist since the first day I saw it. If you have a successfully released and finished episodic game and feel offended by my shitlisting you with the rest you can thank the multiple examples we've had for the last decade of story driven games not making it to the end due to poor sales. (Even this before DLC was a Thing.) (Legacy of Kain in particular, I'm lookin' at you.)
That being said, I can easily understand this "wall" Joe references in the whole episodic release setup. You get into the game, it starts to get good then BAM! Gotta stop and wait 2-4 weeks or whatever before you can see more. (We won't even talk about the Kings Quest thing will we Kane. ^_^) After doing that a few times, I can easily see people losing entire interest in the story which is probably why Telltale tries to push the Season Pass as hard as they do. Get all the money up front, then it doesn't matter (to them) if 50% of the people who were into it for the first chapter or two even bother to download the remaining chapters.
Yerg. Turned this into a much bigger rant than I originally expected.
He does bring up one point near the end however, regarding the season pass thing they do. Full cash up front, while releasing the game chapter by chapter. What it comes back to is this, why do people still give Telltale a pass on releasing the games piece-meal like this after they've been in the industry this long and in theory should be doing fairly well for themselves by now.
As a company starting up, I could certainly understand the episodic nature of their releases. You gotta get material out there ASAP to start bringing in money ASAP. You're new, you're likely a bit strapped for cash flow. But instead of developing into a more proper release schedule - releasing the full story on day one, they simply opted into getting you to PAY for all the episodes on day one instead. To the point where they nag you at the end of the chapter to buy the season pass. (As seen in Joe's video.)
At this stage of the game they SHOULD be capable of releasing the full story on day 1. They've gotten to the point where they're now losing, or drastically delaying money from fans who are no longer putting up with the episode release and wait (Quite intelligently imo) for the full story to be available.
Their season passes could be, as Joe points out, essentially additional chapters after the story - kind of like what they ended up doing with Minecraft Story Mode - although that opens up a new can of worms as well. For instance, if the main story isn't satisfying, people will start looking at the season pass as ripped out content. (Like most DLC appears to be these days, especially for game franchises that have been around since before DLC became a Thing. (Disgaea, I'm lookin' at you.) (Hell, I'm lookin' at you too Ar Tonelico))
At any rate, I don't a reason for them to refuse to release the full game at launch now. They're already charging full price with the season pass at launch of the first chapter. Why not just stop pretending the season pass isn't a preorder. Let them preorder it at that same price tag, then make everyone wait an extra month or two. Don't worry, they'll keep waiting for it. And they won't have that excuse of "Oh I'll wait until the full thing is out." to buy it at launch - although the excuse of waiting for it to be on sale will still be valid. But that's what those people are already doing anyway.
I haven't played any Telltale games. Not entirely sure why, as I rather like story driven games, even if they're hitting on 100 tropes/second. Although episodic game release has been on my shitlist since the first day I saw it. If you have a successfully released and finished episodic game and feel offended by my shitlisting you with the rest you can thank the multiple examples we've had for the last decade of story driven games not making it to the end due to poor sales. (Even this before DLC was a Thing.) (Legacy of Kain in particular, I'm lookin' at you.)
That being said, I can easily understand this "wall" Joe references in the whole episodic release setup. You get into the game, it starts to get good then BAM! Gotta stop and wait 2-4 weeks or whatever before you can see more. (We won't even talk about the Kings Quest thing will we Kane. ^_^) After doing that a few times, I can easily see people losing entire interest in the story which is probably why Telltale tries to push the Season Pass as hard as they do. Get all the money up front, then it doesn't matter (to them) if 50% of the people who were into it for the first chapter or two even bother to download the remaining chapters.
Yerg. Turned this into a much bigger rant than I originally expected.
no subject
Yeah, they did it with Jurassic Park: (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jurassic_Park:_The_Game) The Game (http://kane-magus.livejournal.com/534534.html) (i.e. created and released all episodes at once, as a full game), so I'm with you in not seeing why the fuck they can't do it for the others. People just got used to and accepted the bullshit way of doing things, I guess, so Telltale sees no reason to change things now. (In other words, I blame consumers for this just as much as I do Telltale, same as I do with most other rant-worthy bullshit that the video game industry as a whole does these days, since if consumers didn't suck down the shit, companies wouldn't be able to get away with excreting the shit.)
As for me, with the exception of the Strong Bad game (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong_Bad%27s_Cool_Game_for_Attractive_People) (which is composed of all stand alone episodes, with little to no overarching plotline), I don't, didn't, and won't buy any episodic game, Telltale or (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_Is_Strange) otherwise, (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreamfall_Chapters:_The_Longest_Journey) until all of the episodes (including extra DLC chapter bullshit like what's going on with Minecraft (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minecraft:_Story_Mode) Story (http://owsf2000.livejournal.com/130834.html) Mode (http://kane-magus.livejournal.com/834779.html)) are available to be played. (Well, no, to be fair and honest, I did actually back Dreamfall Chapters on Kickstarter, but that's a whole other kettle of fish, I suppose.)
I might still play the Minecraft game, once the whole thing is released and in (what I consider to be) a reasonably priced full, complete package (though my interest seriously wanes with every new bit of bullshit news that comes out about the game). And I'll likely play this new Batman game at some nebulous point in the future as well, once it is similarly complete. And I'll probably enjoy them. But yeah, I generally think the whole "episodic release" thing is bullshit.
In general, Telltale's games are usually pretty good, great even, once they're complete. Aside, of course, from some terrible, (http://kane-magus.livejournal.com/613993.html) long-standing (http://kane-magus.livejournal.com/806467.html) bugs that they should have fucking fixed ages ago (and never should have released with in the first place, in my opinion), of course.
And you mention Legacy of Kain, yeah. Shenmue, too. As for King's Quest, even though that shit (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Silver_Lining_(video_game)) is fucking free, I still haven't touched it, and won't be touching it, until they fucking release the final episode, which seems less and less like it will ever happen with each passing year. Oh, wait, you might be talking about that other episodic King's Quest game, (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King%27s_Quest_(2015_video_game)) the one that isn't free (and which also has its own share of issues (http://kane-magus.livejournal.com/789140.html)). My bad. Yeah, haven't touched and won't be touching that one either, at least not until it is finished.
no subject
no subject
I have the same mindset now about movies that release in multiple parts. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Production_of_Avengers:_Infinity_War_and_the_untitled_Avengers_sequel) I hate that kind of shit with an undying passion, and refuse to see the movies until the "whole" movie has been released. Hell, I still haven't even bothered to see The Hobbit (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hobbit_(film_series)) yet, even though that's all out now.
And, hell, I'm even kind of starting to feel that way about unfinished book series that are part of huge multi-book story arcs (e.g. A Song of Ice and Fire (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Song_of_Ice_and_Fire)).
no subject
I have Lord of the Rings on bluray - waited until there was an 3-movie collection setup for them for relatively cheap. I think I paid 30 in total? Maybe 40, but that would have been my limit if so. For some reason when I bought it I thought it was a bluray/dvd combo, so I was a bit peeved when I found it was bluray only. (Mostly boycotting bluray-only stuff over issues with the format's DRM and whatnot, so for the most part I'll only pick up blurays when they're bundled with dvds as "backup". I'll be seriously pissed at a company that forces me to connect my bluray player to the internet (because we all know how secure IoT devices are - ie: they aren't.) just to watch the purchased bluray.)
I got off on a tangent there didn't I. :D
Anyway, yeah, I waited til the entire trilogy was out before I bought it. I've -seen- all of the hobbit, but that's due to watching it at my sister's. If I see a bluray-dvd combo trilogy for the hobbit (not making the same mistake again!) for a decent price, I'll pick that up myself. Otherwise, meh. I wasn't overly engaged with the movie(s) anyway. Nice, but not awesome.
no subject
Sounds familiar to how the video game industry does things, too, right? I.e., the "collectors"/"limited"/"ultimate"/"definitive"/"complete" editions of games that typically include all the DLC and get released months after the initial, gutted releases. Well, unless said "complete" editions get released along side the gutted releases, of course. I guess that wouldn't be the case with movies, since I can't think of any DVD/Bluray releases that were concurrent with theatrical releases. So, in that sense, I guess the video game industry is still the more disgustingly greedy.